THe importance of using reputable suppliers...

[socialgiraffe]

Most of you probably saw Justin's post about the trouble he has had with regards to a recent purchase that did not go to plan. So I thought I would add this to show how important it is to always use reputable suppliers...

I recently purchased an all singing and dancing DTF machine. After the success with my clients using the "little one" supplied by Ink Experts I decided this was definately something that I need to invest in on a major level. I chose a machine and purchased it from a very reputable supplier, you will understand why I will not name them. The machine was purchased in the first week of December with a view that I would go and get the machine and install it inbetween Christmas and the New Year.

That is when my troubles began, leaks everywhere, suspected air intake on some of the ink lines, incorrect Waveforms are just a few of the problems. This was not the UK suppliers fault (too long to excplain why) but it was fast becoming obvious that I was going round and round in circles with it. I was also dealing direct with the Chinese manufacturer, who I decided knew less about the machine than I did and would blatantly lie to me about various things.

Move forward to the first week of Feb, in the 6 weeks of having the machine I had only managed a total of 35 transfers which normally would be rejected but had to be used. Material wise this had cost me 1 litre of Cyan, Magenta and Yellow plus 2 litres of white PLUS around 80+ meters of film. I also had a very experienced DTF engineer spend two days on the machine and it still did not work.

That was it, the machine was going back.

The UK supplier was kept in the loop throughout my problems and when I decided enough was enough they offered a full refund immediately and without question. I can not fault their service and sometimes, it is only when things go tits up do you see the true measure of a company's reputation...

However my problems did not end there. I still had hundreds of transfers to make for a very large national retail chain. The COO of that company phoned me personally and screamed at me to get the f**king garments sorted NOW...

EEK

It was now 3.30pm on Friday afternoon and I had a few hundred DTF transfers to make with no machine. So I turned to Ink Experts asking them if they have a L1800 in stock and if so can they get it to me on a PRE12 tomorrow... Alex said it was absolutely no problem. The machine arrived 11.30am Saturday morning and by 1pm I was printing transfers. Yes it was/is slower than the "proper" machine but it got me out of trouble and continues to do so a week later. So much so that I may ditch the bigger machine and keep the money in the bank instead

Both the company that sold the initial faulty machine and Ink Experts have excellent reputations and I have no doubt in my mind that IE got me out of trouble that weekend because if I had lost that contract it would have been a huge blow to the business.

Moral of the story, stick to the people you know or have a good reputation and build a relationship with them. The saving of using a dodgy supplier will backfire...

[pw66]

If you can make do with your Epsons for a while longer I have been told that Mimaki have a machine very imminent. Roland have a DTF BN20, and I am sure they will have something bigger/faster not far behind.

The days of the no name Chinese machines are few and far between.

[socialgiraffe]

If you can make do with your Epsons for a while longer I have been told that Mimaki have a machine very imminent. Roland have a DTF BN20, and I am sure they will have something bigger/faster not far behind.

The days of the no name Chinese machines are few and far between.

I spoke to someone regarding the BN20 and I just don't get it. Firstly it will be too slow, secondly, you will never need a cutter on a DTF machine so unless I am missing something such as interchangeable ink sets I just do not see the point of it.

The machine I had was an Audley and despite the issues it is clearly a very well made machine using two Epson print heads (I forget which ones but they are darn good), the issue was the software snd not having someone who knows how to set it up and speaks very good English. I would even consider buying from them again, but only when there is a supplier who installs them instead of just selling.

I have a shaker on the way and if that works then the L1800 will do me for a long time. Considering a 30cm "made for DTF" machine will be 12k+ I can purchase quite a few L1800's before I spend 12k

[pw66]

Lack of aftercare is what has put me off buying from China. Big savings but still risking a lot of money.

The speed of the BN20 has put me off of that, and 50 cm width is not always wide enough for two large prints. I assumed that it would have the cutter removed for DTF. Waiting to see what Mimaki are offering. Might even consider converting my CJV150 - there a guy in America that has been selling them for a few months. Only one head, but still faster than a BN20.

How are you getting on with the L1800? Are the heads holding out ok? I said I wouldn't get one, but like you say a lot cheaper than £12k. I do 400 shirt runs on them for sublimation so I suppose I can consider them for DTF.

[socialgiraffe]

L1800 is doing really well to be honest. I had a huge back log of around 400 hi vis, Managed to get the transfers done and almost all of them pressed within a couple of days. It's not ideal because right now if the L1800 is printing you can not wander too far away from it, but that is going to change very soon.

I am building a roll feeder for it (although they are only £200 to buy) and will get the roll software which is £30.00. I have also ordered a shaker which will be here in about 30 days. I have taken a bit of a chance on this, but as there is not much too them I should be able to adapt/fix any issues.

In total to get a 30CM roll fed DTF printer with shaker unit is going to cost me around £1800.

I haven't researched too much yet, but if you can wet cap the L1800 heads that will be a good thing to have because right now it has to have a gentle head clean each morning. Once done it happily prints all day.

One final piece will be to change the white eco tank to a third party one that has a white ink stirrer built in. I have seen one for sale on Ali Express so might take a punt.

Sourcing 30CM rolls can be a bit of a challenge, but Ink Experts are stocking them for me so I will have a decent (and more importantly consistent) supply.

They are not taking the cutter out on the BN20, the sales literature says "Use it as a vinyl cutter when you are not printing DTF".... I think I would rather keep them seperate, especially when a cheap cutter will be three times quicker and a lot cheaper

Knowing what I know now and having learnt a lot over the last few weeks I wished I had gone L1800 route to start. I find them to be a very versatile printer that can be used for a huge array of ink sets and are also easily available. THey are also quite easy to fix yourself. My flatbed UV is based on a L1800 so I could potentially purchase another printer and keep that on the shelf should anything go wrong with either. Its only £700 for a new machine which is peanuts for the work they output and still a fraction of the cost of a "proper" DTF

[Mrteajunkie]

Can I ask a stupid question?

Is dtf only for clothing?
I have seen videos of people putting dtf on mugs glasses and all sorts of different items.

If it can be used on more substrates then I may be interested in one myself.
clothing isn’t really something I do a lot of so if that’s all it’s for then it’s no good for me.

[socialgiraffe]

At the moment, DTF is mainly for clothing. I have used the film to print on to some Moleskin notebooks and also some conference folders but I haven't tried that many items at the moment.

However, there are machines starting to be released that are using UV ink. These require an additional process where the film is printed and them laminated before applying to a mug (for example). I am waiting on this a bit more before purchasing because UV inks are quite thick and I suspect the heads will require a lot of maintenance.

I am going to try a piece of current film on to a mug later this week to see what happens and if there is any success I will post here.

[Paul]

Glue has nowhere to go so it showing around theme design.i tried pressing Dtf on metal and wood. Wood was ok ish

[mr-gobby]

Saw the mimaki DTF in operation at Sign and digital yesterday, I didn't get to see it at P&P as there was swarms around it. It looks okay, apparently shaker is an Adkins product but mot enough in country yet so orders are being taken (Xpres) but no deliveries at present. Later there will be an 800 wide shaker for wider media (currently 600) £11500 for printer and with shaker will be around £15500 + vat - Told you need to clean down each time after use/end of day and okay to leave a day or two but not tested leaving it longer which is being trialled at present so no holidays for anyone! Runs without too much operator intervention, needs sensible environment humidity around 55-65 else adhesive can clag, temperature control so not too cold else get condensation in drier, as seen because the shaker had been stored in a van overnight so was steaming a bit. Has a built in filter system.