Digi Coat Spray

[Paul Richards]

Have any members used this product supplied by Octi-Tech Ltd based in Sheffield.
This product allows you to use more or less use any surface to be sublimated by Spraying the substrate with their chemicals thus allowing you to to place a photograph on it in the normal way.
I have been looking at ways to put images on to Yorkshire stone and maybe this product could be the answer

http://digicoat.com/ watch the videos

Any body tried it ?

[John G]

I've seen this stuff and always wanted to try it - i'd be interested to hear if anyone's used it too!

[Paul]

great but it means you need to use 2 of them so price is going up double. If you want to sublimate on stone why not try slates?? or Yorkshire stone is any diferent??

[Paul Richards]

Paul, well its the whole principle of using a substrate, which I can supply without a supplier having to sell me a coated substrate. This would open opportunities to do different things not just Yorkshire stone.

[Matt Quinn]

Paul, well its the whole principle of using a substrate, which I can supply without a supplier having to sell me a coated substrate. This would open oppertunities to do different things not just Yorkshire stone.

It certainly open up possibilities... They key I feel being to differentiate oneself from competitors through creating original creative products. - Personally I have difficulty constructing a good business case for getting involved with many of the more typical/conventional products that dye sub is used for...

I've wondered about the possible composition of this material and whether there were prospects of a product that could be sprayed with conventional paint spraying equipment.

With that said, there have been waterslide papers available for many years; printable using low-cost conventional inks... And finishable with things like automotive laquers...

I may be wrong; but it seems to me sublimation only really has an advantage when the coating can be bonded to the substrate such that it is superior to anything that can be achieved by more conventional methods... i.e. the coating becomes an intergral PART of the substrate...

I'd like to learn what advantage a one-part, air dried, non-baked sublimatable coating has over a conventional transfer protected by a one-part, air dried, non-baked 'paint type' product.

Im also interested in the UV protectant product... I can think of at least one product I'd like to make which would have to survive a somewhat hostile outdoor environment. - And UV protection would be a major barrier crossed.

[Paul Richards]

Hi Matt
I think you have touched on a subject I have not seen discussed on this forum. ( remember I am new Here). "Personally I have difficulty constructing a good business case for getting involved with many of the more typical/conventional products that dye sub is used for"... Yes the subject matter being, "Profit".
When you consider the capital outlay, A3+ Press, A3+ Sublimation printer, raw materials and one use paper plus the most important factor "Time", Then you are not going to be a "Millionaire" over night.
Prior to getting involved with sublimation printing I did a limited market research on what shops sell goods appropriate to the sublimation industry, One example was coasters, shops sell these at less than £4 00 to £5.00 per set of four including stands, which is near to the cost price the sublimation worker starts with just in materials, not to mention taking the photograph applying artwork and actual physically making the coaster.
The reason I personally got involved with sublimation printing is that it is an "Add On to an existing long established photographic business and allows me to offer another service to established clients besides new clients.
Needless to say any images I use, I have full copyright because my company have taken the images.People are not involved so it is not necessary to get model release forms signed.
My first impressions of this industry is that the raw materials are too costly and it would seem that suppliers do not want to enter into any form of serious discounting.
It is a labour intensive industry which sadly would seem very much underpaid.
However, you have the choice to get involved or not. As a stand alone occupation is 24 hours in a working day long enough.

[John G]

shops sell these at less than £4 00 to £5.00 per set of four including stands

I think you are missing the point - the coasters you have quotes are mass produced therefore have a very cheap selling price. The beauty about sublimation is the products can be one off's or personalised and people will be prepared to pay for this service.

[Paul Richards]

Hi John, This was just one example,unfortunately the market place can determine how much an article can be sold for. Also regional areas of the country can effect market prices. I believe in todays market conditions, sadly price does come into the equation.
There is no comparison between mass produced items and limited edition sublimated items, as you say, "qualitywise", but there is a limit to what you can ask for your work, and this is relevent to what is out there in the market today. Sadly the general public are looking at cost rather than quality, has purse strings tighten.

[Matt Quinn]

Hi Paul,

Like yourself I'm coming to the technique as an add-on to an existing business...

Though I'm primarily a video producer my roots lie in photography (I'm a cameraman by 'trade') and I've always done some amount of commercial stills work... Naturally as technology has changed this side of things has moved from primarily darkroom based work to digital... With close family members who are involved in graphics and fine art... Well; we start to have the makings of a cohesive business profile.

I started in business - self employment really- some 25 years ago, in a trade I am trained, qualified and experienced in. It took heavy investment, time, and climbing a steep learning curve, to the extent I HAD to go an learn a second 'trade' as a business manager; even to the extent of seeking out a formal education in that field.

It's by no means unique to dye sub work... And very definitely SHOULDN'T be seen as any particular reflection of the technique or those who work with it... BUT...

The notion of a 'turnkey business' is an attractive one. And that is often 'sold to' (mis-sold IMHO) individuals who, for one reason or another, see 'being in business for themselves' as the way forward... But being in business doing what exactly?

Many come to this sort of situation in mid-life after a career is some skilled but exclusive field. I have a close relative for instance who came from working in the nuclear energy industry and latterly education... After redundancy he tried (and failed at) becoming a driving instructor, runing a sandwich shop (in the middle of a housng estate! -go figure!) - And was eventually 'sold' a plotter/cutter in the form of a 'turnkey signmaking' business...

- Which as far as I can see does now't! Don't even know if it's still cluttering up his spare room as I've not seen him for years... I could have made money from that kit; but then I would have been bringing a whole different skillset to the table...

But still individuals like this persist - imagining that there is some 'magic bullet' solution to starting and running a worthwhile business...

I've other friends who were sold 'windscreen repair' franchises - Only to have to flog the remains of their kit to the local garage mechanic when they just couldn't make it work. - Window blinds, Christmas decorations, cards and crafting... You name it!

I can't blame the suppliers... Who are also generally the importers. Though I DO have a bit of a problem with those who's real business is parting the desparate from their redundancy cheques by flogging them whatever half-baked notion they happen to be importing this week...

NOT in the above category I stress... Of the Dye Sub suppliers I can think of one who is basically in competition with the people they supply. But to be honest, if I was operating on a medium-large scale printing promo material, could get a bulk price break on what I was importing... And saw the opportunity to offload what stock I couldn't use by diverisfying into supplying smaller operators...

Pefectly valid and reasonable business strategy IMHO.

Important to realise that different people will have different needs and expectations from the trade... Different levels of technical skill and creative talent too. As well as realism... Watch "Dragon's Den" for evidence of that! :biggrin:

Yesterday we, as a family, visited a well-known attraction in Lanarkshire. In the gift shop I saw a pack of 4 coasters (probably litho) for £2! - The reality of that is they need to be sold to the shop at £1 packaged and ready for sale. - Even at £5 for a pack of four - As a rule of thumb you need to supply shops at approximately 50% of the shelf price.

I'm not knocking those who are prepared to do it and are satisfied with the return; each to their own... and I wish them every success. But the market stall, car boot, ebay etc... Personally I just can't make those numbers stack up.

Difficult really to blame the suppliers though IMHO... Importing 10,000 coasters is something you could definitely do yourself - IF you've the time, money to invest, facilities to store etc...

Repackaging them in tens or hundreds... Well that's another investment... Time, money, risk... distribution costs. IF it emerges that some of your end-users are beginning to baulk at their costs and not able to make a cogent business case for buying from you...

Which is where we come back full-circle to looking a more diverse product...

[Paul]

I think we when off the track a bit...