Anyone know the legal position re a photo you own but which contains a TM logo?

[MREDD]

Hi All

I will try to explain this as best I can, I should point out that I have spoken to the Governments IPO office (Intellectual Property) they could not answer it, also the Copyright Law Society, they could not answer it & when you speak to a solicitor who supposedley specializes in Copyright law all you get then is "It's a grey area!"

So here is the problem, a mate has taken some really good photos of airliners landing & taking off at Heathrow & we think they will look great on Jigsaws.

Now the images in the photos clearly show airliners displaying their liveries, which are of course TM, but they're my mates photos taken on his camera & on council land & he gives me his permission to use them.

Depending upon who you speak to some will say if it was a picture showing several airlines then it is not deemed as associating itself to one particular airline, but a photo showing one aircraft might suggest that the airline is in some way condoning it's use.

Does anyone have a clear definative answer for this dilema?

TIA

Ed

[R.Prints]

Try contacting the airline direct and ask for permission to use his pictures, can't see them saying no as it's free advertising for them in a way.

[mrs maggot]

I would guess its down to how you sell them ie:

Virgin Airlines stunning 50pc Jigsaw
Heathrow Airport take off puzzle colelction 1 - 20
up up and away, a collection of airline jigsaws

1 & 2 you are selling them as the actual product ie the airport and the brand, but on 3 you are not, but again you would need to but Boeing or whatever in your name or it will never get picked up in search results. do a few and test it out, but do not use the brand names perhaps ?

[socialgiraffe]

On such a grey area I would say use them. You have sought legal advice and no one has given a straight answer. In cases like this, if the airline (for example) did feel it infringed copyright they would initiate a cease and desist order, basically meaning stop or we will take it further.

Mrs Maggot is right though, not sure you would want to put "Virgin Airlines plane at Heathrow take off" on it.

[Smart Mart]

If there is any trademark on the photo then you need permission to use it for commercial use regardless where you took it, otherwise you could for example take a photo of the addidas logo & then print it on a mug-same thing.Copyright & Trademark are completely different things. Ipo won't give you an answer.Just photoshop out any trademarks that are visable & you are good to go.

[James990]

Can't you take out the airline logo, and just use the pictures that way?

[Andrew]

I remember a similar scenario years ago for the largest passenger plane and was told if photo was taken from airport land then couldn't be used but outside of that it was fine. Many will have different opinions and even those supposedly in the know. You only find details out what side of the grey line you are on many of the cases when the judge delivers their verdict........ and even then might come down to what side of the bed they got out of that morning.

[Mike McHugh]

Remove all the TM's from the pics and you will be fine....otherwise you will need a signed 'property release' from all of the companies whose logos/TM's are recognizable.

[logobear]

there must be a BIG question, - WHY do they put their logos on the side of the thing in the first place?
I suggest that an earlier remark contains the best argument .... just make and promote your product as an 'airport image', - don't refere to ANY branding that might appear.
Worst case, - the brand objects ..... which they won't, - and if they do, - you remove product. compliance!
If any small fish is legally challanged, - just comply immediately, - then they cannot have a ground to bother taking it any further....... just Do NOT advertise
"BRITISH AIRWAYS Boeing 747 at Heathrow" puzzle ..... just advertise airport puzzle !