Sawgrass Patent Discussion

[pisquee]

Due to the amount of work we do that involves sublimation (both through the Epson, and with paint brushes!) we have to buy inks and powders in bulk. Because of this, I am now selling spare stock of Inktec's (Sawgrass licensed) sublimation inks on ebay. I don't want this to be an advert, so won't link, but am easy to find there if you want it. Although, as I know there may be interest from people here, I thought it best to say hello, and say I am open to discussion/queries.

[Justin]

As far as I'm aware Inktec are not licensed for small format printers which the vast majority of members will be using. There was a little confusion when a Supplier first announced that the licence had been granted. Did Sawgrass not provide a profile for the 4400?

Justin
DSF Admin

[bms]

Hi and welcome. From memory Justin's right and the Epsons you mention aren't considered wide format.

[pisquee]

From the perspective of my art printing, I wanted to source an ink that was licensed, so that it was available, I initially was tempted by the generic cheap sub inks that sometimes pop up on ebay, but didn't want to get all set up with these, and then they disappear, or the ink in the bottles got changed to something else. /i had also thought of mixing and matching whatever cheap deals of odd bottles of Artainium or Rotech whenever they popped up, but then realised this wasn't a good way to go either.
I don't like that Sawgrass have effectively created a monopoly with their patents, but I can't do much about that. I understand that they don't want other companies using technology they own, and so let companies license being able to use it. So, InkTec are licensed to produce sublimation ink, and sell it in bottles. i think they are stretching their control to think they can dictate whether I am allowed to put it into my printer or not, especially dependant on their definition of what is large format or not. The inks are licensed in their production, and to be sold, they work fine in Epson printers from home up to the pro series.

On the subject of ICC profiles, InkTec don't offer many on their website, for any of their inks really, as there are so many different prints available that inks can be put into, this doesn't surprise me. and from my point of view, each printer is a little bit different, and then what is being printed on is different etc etc, so even if they did, I would likely want profiles making for my own printer regardless of what was offered form the manufacturer.

[bms]

It's probably too complex to get into the details of the patents, but as as supplier of sawgrass inks then I only know too well the license arrangements and large format ink can only be sold to customers owning a large format printer (as defined by a printer carriage width of 42" or more).

It is the responsibility of the supplier to make sure that the customer has a printer that meets the conditions upon which the reseller status is granted. If Sawgrass were to learn that a customer has bought ink from a recognised supplier that does not have a license to sell into the small format printers (such as the Epson 4000), then this would be serious for the supplier concerned and I'm sure that wasn't your intention.

[mugstar]

Welcome to the forum - I cannot see your ebay listing lasting too long before it's pulled though!

what eBay listing John?

[John G]

I am now selling spare stock of Inktec's (Sawgrass licensed) sublimation inks on ebay.

Original post

Just got to look on ebay for anybody selling sub ink that's supposed to be for large format, but sold to anybody with an epson

[mugstar]

Doh! missed that...

[John G]

Doh! missed that...

I had to go back and re-read it just to make sure :redface:

[pisquee]

I had a try reading through the documents on the European Patent Office site, but got confused. I wasn't sure if Sawgrass were trying to patent the whole process of sublimation/heat transfer printing - not just with computer printers, or maybe that document was just defining what type of printing they were talking about.

Is there anything similar to the Sawgrass situation in another industry, where a manufacturer effectively can say how/where their product is used once resold? I guess Applie saying that OSX can only be used on their hardware is similar, but not the same, as Sawgrass don't make heat presses/printers, and you can't really buy a full copy of OSX without also buying a computer from them.

Is the way Sawgrass are controlling things actually legal in UK/European law?