Mug Quality issues - anyone else noticed a decline?

[arthur.daley]

Hi All

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed a decline in mug quality of late? Specifically the inside of sublimation mugs

I am told - possibly erroneously, that the sublimation mug producers are changing the way they coat mugs.

Previously they would have been put, upside down, onto a tapered mandrel which would have effectively sealed the inside of the mug whilst it was being sprayed with the polyester coating resulting in a nice clean and glossy interior.

I am being told that that is all changing and that producers in the far east, India or wherever are now placing the mugs, right way up, onto a conveyor and then the mugs are sprayed, resulting in the inside of the mug now being partially coated to a greater or lesser degree with oversprayed coating.

I have seen some mugs produced this way and didn't think much to them - the inside was really matt and just looked like it was going to stain as soon as it was used. The ones with a heavy overspray actually felt a bit unpleasant on the lip when used. Before anyone says - "brilliant, now i can print on the inside of a mug as well" - I don't think so. The overspray is no where near as thick as the proper coating, it hasn't 'fused' together when the mug has gone back into the oven after coating.

I have showed the mugs to a couple of my clients, didn't tell them anything had changed about these mugs compared to ones I had previously supplied. Both said they looked fine until they picked them up and felt the inside. Both said they didn't want them. It wasn't a question of whether the mugs actually would stain quickly or suffer with spoon marks, it was a question of perceived quality. They weren't at all happy with me supplying them with these 'new' mugs.

So I was on the phone to my supplier who announced that all of their mugs would now be like this and they expected everyone elses to be the same as old stock cleared and new stock came online.

I know i can be a p bit picky when it comes to quality but all of my customers know that I don't let anything go that I am not happy with and they pay a premium price for that quality assurance. There is no way I could let these go to my regular customers or any new clients and to be honest I am not even sure that I would want to use the 11 boxes (from two totally different sources) I currently have as conference mugs.

So the question is - is it just me? Have any of you noticed a change to the insides of mugs you have purchased recently?

I haven't put this message here because I want to launch into some kind of name and shame back biting session, but I suspect that there will be a few other mug printers here who, if the story I am being given is true, will be finding themselves in the same boat.

Just remember, before you reply that all of your stock is just as it has always been - glossy outside and glossy inside, when did you take delivery of that stock. I get the impression that this is a new issue that has arisen in the last month or so, ie if your stock is more than a month old it could well be pre production method change stock.



Arthur

Anyone want to buy 11 boxes of iffy mugs???? No me neither (

[JMugs]

I shall check my next order. On white mugs I order in bulk so it may be after Christmas, hope it's not the case.
Thanks for the heads up.

Janners

[arthur.daley]

I shall check my next order. On white mugs I order in bulk so it may be after Christmas, hope it's not the case.
Thanks for the heads up.

Janners

it would definitely be worth asking the question "are these mugs coated upside down and therefore the inside is totally free of overspray?"

[pisquee]

I think this needs to be followed up, with either suppliers themselves posting about their own supply chains, and/or users posting who they're getting mugs from and whether or not they see a change.
Not all mugs come from the same factory, or even the same country.
I can see there would be some efficiency in changing production in the way stated, but it would mean investment in new machinery, or adapting current machinery, either of which isn't an easy choice for a factory, as it means stopping production to change over.
So the idea that every factory coatings mugs around the world are all going to change their machinery over at the same time doesn't ring true.
Are we just talking about the factories who only coat the mugs they buy in, or the factories who also mould/fire their own ceramics?

Company making our mugs, makes the ceramic and does the coating, and not noticed quality shifting over the years of them producing them for us. Next pallet load coming in next week, and I have no concerns about this batch being any different from previous.

I think if you're buying budget mugs, or from a budget supplier, then I would never be surprised if any part of their supply chain changed to keep costs down, and therefore what you've found could be that they aren't actually the same mugs as one of the lonks in the supply chain may have fond a cheaper source. I'd would be more surprised if a quality, high-end, pro level supplier had mugs change like you describe.

[arthur.daley]

Hi Pisquee

I am please that you have replied as you will have a different perspective being at the other end of the production spectrum.

I wish I could say that the mugs came from two budget suppliers If that were the case i would have kept quiet, muttered and sworn that i should have known better, sold the mugs on ebay and taken the loss on the chin. However, as it happens, I am sorry to have to say that both suppliers are premium suppliers of premium grade products - or at least they have been in the past they both supply in quantities of one box to multiple pallets. The mugs in question were sold as 'A' grade, NOT seconds. I do not buy from ebay or other iffy suppliers. These were not 'cheap' mugs.

I do not know specifically where the mugs were manufactured or coated. I have 5 boxes from one supplier and 6 boxes from another which have different coatings. I cannot be certain they are from different factories but have no reason to believe that they are.

The supplier who has said that "all coating plants will go over to this production method" is a well known UK supplier to the sub trade, not some mickey mouse outfit run from a lock up garage in the back streets of who knows where. I have no reason to believe or disbelieve what they are telling me - although I can't see any good reason for them to be less than truthful as they would surely know that the truth will out sooner or later and they would look a bit silly to have told whoppers just to get rid of some iffy stock.

Things would be a bit different for you if you are buying direct from the manufacturer and importing them yourself, especially if you have a good working relationship with the company. Well - I hope they are different and you have a manufacturer who can be trusted beyond all doubt to look after you as it will be a long way to send them back ;o)

I just need to reiterate this coating issue is VERY recent. I have seen the change in the last couple of months, so the change could have taken place at the coating plant(s) in the two or three months prior to that. This is NOT a gradual decline over years. On reflection it was a mistake to put the word 'decline' in the subject as that implies they have become gradually worse, which is NOT the case. In terms of the mugs supplied to me it was a case batch A supplied in July/August = good, just like they always have been and batch B supplied mid September = overspray all around the inside.

I too would think that if a change has taken place in production methods it is because someone has found they can coat mugs for a few pennies less each, which is a huge saving for the manufacturer given the huge volumes involved in the lifetime of a coating line. Why would they need to replace a coating line? Could be the need to expand production capability. Could be that the old line is at the end of its life and costing too much money in down time to keep it running. Could be someone has done their sums and figured out that a new 'mug upright' production line will pay for itself in [insert appropriate time frame here]. It could be a combination or these and many other reasons. I was also a bit doubtful that EVERY manufacturer would move over to this method unless the savings were substantial and they found they were no longer able to compete on price with the coating plants that had made the move. Therefore if they couldn't continue to sell the necessary volume of mugs at the higher price for a mug with a clean inside they either go down the same route as the others or go bust.

I have contacted another major trade supplier who insists that their mugs have NO overspray and are glossy inside and out. I should have a sample in the post on Monday and if it looks good I will drive to their warehouse next week and pick up 10 boxes - and open them all before I leave. Its not that I don't trust them but i already have a stack of mugs that were supposed to be glossy inside and out with no overspray.

In all fairness to the suppliers in question, one has said they will take them back if I am not happy with them and did suggest I might want to just hang on to their mugs until I actually have some replacements as the replacements could be the same or worse than the mugs I already have. We haven't discussed who is paying for the two lots of carriage involved yet. The other supplier knows I am not happy but hasn't offered to take them back yet. When I said to them "I don't know if its just me setting my expectations too high but these mugs are just not as good as the ones I have purchased in the past" - they replied that they "thought it possible that my expectations were too high and that no one else had mentioned any concerns about the overspray" . So it would seem that they think its me making a fuss over nothing which I find a pretty shitty attitude to take.

regards


Arthur

[Reg]

I'm not using the quantities that you guys use but have noticed the rough inside on my last 2 or 3 boxes so I bought a box of A grade a couple of weeks ago from another supplier and they are very smooth inside.As nobody is mentioning any company names I'll PM the company to you if it helps.

[arthur.daley]

Thanks Reg

Your 'rough' supplier is not the same as one of mine and nor is your 'smooth' supplier

If anyone else would like to PM me and let me know the rough or smooth status of any blank Durham or Durham style mugs that they have purchased in the last couple of weeks I will draw up a 'league table' and make a few phone calls.


Arthur

[socialgiraffe]

I have also noticed this, but I know I get my mugs from the same supplier as Mr Daley so it comes as no surprise. At first I figured it was just a bad batch, but now having read all about it here I am beginning to think that they will all be like this in the future. It is disappointing as it is very noticeable and as the new way of coating will be more prone to staining it will have an affect on the business.

Having read this thread I may contact a couple of other suppliers to see what they say. I have long been thinking about re-engaging with Raja again so may order a few samples.

As far as the 11 boxes go Arthur, I may take them off you depending on the price . I about to land an order for 1700 and have sampled the mug you have in those boxes. Am off on holiday for a few days so will touch base with you on my return.

[Quinsfan]

There is this post here about something similar. Mugs discolouring on the inside.
http://www.dyesubforum.co.uk/vbforum/sh ... -Best-mugs

[mrs maggot]

so far ours have been ok, but we get them from a supplier within walking distance to us, i wonder if when their current stocks are changed over we will notice a change in mugs - worrying times arthur indeed