Dilema for Dark Garments ................

[Paul]

not bad idea JSR!!!
there already are black mugs with the white patch so t-shirts should be ok too

[accdave]

I've seen a few manufacturers advertising custom garments. Maybe somebody knows a good one who can look at this and we can buy a batch between us. I look forward to seeing the samples

[DREAMGLASS]

The problem with putting printable patches on the garment itself, is then you have to design your imagery to fit the patches exactly, otherwise you end up with unsightly white areas you cannot cut out.

I sometimes reflect on the massive technological changes that have happened in our world over the last forty years, but the astonishing fact that we still can't do something as simple as putting an image onto a dark tee. Or more precisely one that will last without cracking or peeling.

[JSR]

The problem with putting printable patches on the garment itself, is then you have to design your imagery to fit the patches exactly, otherwise you end up with unsightly white areas you cannot cut out.

That would be a concern for custom shaped designs but at least if there were garments with A4 and/or A3 patches, then they would at least address the requirement for full colour photos of A4 and A3 sizes.

This would be just the same as the black mugs that have white patches on them. They aren't suitable for logos or text, but they are ideal for putting a full colour photo on them in the same way you would with a white mug.

If you want to put a simple logo or text on a dark garment, you can at least cut them out with flock or flex and do them but there is not, at present, any option for full colour photos that doesn't involve some form of "sticky paper". At least if there was one option for putting a photo on a dark garment using a white polyester patch, it'd be a step in the right direction.

I sometimes reflect on the massive technological changes that have happened in our world over the last forty years, but the astonishing fact that we still can't do something as simple as putting an image onto a dark tee. Or more precisely one that will last without cracking or peeling.

This is, I think, because the dye-sub industry is held in the iron grip of one main ink supplier that doesn't invest their profits in R&D. We shouldn't still be forced into using third-party printers with the "square peg in round hole" technology after all these years.

By now, those who make all the money with the expensive dye-sub inks should have invested in R&D for their own printers. They could easily have been well on the way to inventing a printer with white ink in one of the chambers to act as a base. Or developed opaque rather than transparent inks that don't rely on a white base in the first place. Anything along this line would at least justify the ink's high price.

That would have happened if there the dye-sub ink industry had competition, rather than being a monopoly held by one manufacturer. The industry stagnates, nothing changes, and we're still stuck without the ability to print on non-white items.

[DREAMGLASS]

That certain ink manufacturer DOES have competition. For those with larger format printers they have a choice of brands from some mainstream manufacturers, that a certain ink manufacturer probably daren't try to take to court to 'prove' their claimed patent.

If someone came up with a viable system to get sublimation images onto dark garments, I have no doubt at all that it would prove be be an instant success. As things stand at the moment though, I have a feeling that dtg as it gets more popular, will kill off most of the subli tees trade, purely as dark coloured tees radically outsell white tees.

[JSR]

That certain ink manufacturer DOES have competition. For those with larger format printers they have a choice of brands from some mainstream manufacturers, that a certain ink manufacturer probably daren't try to take to court to 'prove' their claimed patent.

Their patent only applies for sublimation ink for use in desktop printers, which is why their prices are lower for larger format use - which, I imagine, makes it difficult for suppliers who have to prove whether you're using large format printers to qualify for the lower prices. That's why they don't try to sue suppliers of ink for large format printers.

Someone posted the patent some time ago around the time of the last big battle (and the last hope we had of any real competition in the small-format marketplace). The patent, IIRC, referred to using dye-sublimation ink in printers with a thermal printhead (like HP/Canon printers). That would have been an interesting avenue for them to explore, but then the micropiezo printhead came along to make it easier for them. Now there's no one left to challenge the patent and so we are where we are, and it's why nothing will ever change.

If someone came up with a viable system to get sublimation images onto dark garments, I have no doubt at all that it would prove be be an instant success. As things stand at the moment though, I have a feeling that dtg as it gets more popular, will kill off most of the subli tees trade, purely as dark coloured tees radically outsell white tees.

All the more reason for the suppliers to get on the ball now (for instance, with patchwork garments), to take advantage of the gap in the market while we wait for DTG to become affordable.

[DREAMGLASS]

I use a large format 9600 series printer, so I'm not tied to paying silly ink prices. Some time ago, I tried some large format ink in an elderly 1160 printer as was curious as to what it would actually do. It may not come as any suprise to report that it worked absolutely fine AND without the clogging problems associated with another brand of ink. The 9600 series and 1100 series use similar print heads.

DTG has got more affordable by virtue of the fact that there are secondhand machines available in more volume now. I have seen quite a few in recent times below the 4K mark. For those with some aptitude, building your own dtg is also viable, I know as I built my own using another 1160 printer. Only ever used it with pigment inks, but know others use them with textile inks and get good results.

[JSR]

I use a large format 9600 series printer

Is there an emoticon for "green with envy"? :biggrin::biggrin: It must be a fantastic printer to work with.

[Stitch Up]

Printed vinyl is great for small designs - badges, logos, left breast sorta stuff. It's great for larger designs on sports clothing - stuff that's gonna get rough treatment etc BUT, for fashion shirts, forget it - it's horrible. Just like slapping a peice of plastic on the front, it feels awful and also has an unwanted sheen. We've done it and still do it in certain circumstances.

[DREAMGLASS]

The 9600 series are extremely robust and a superb buy secondhand as they will literally last forever. Apart from the width, they also take up a lot less room that you anticipate. Some folks use them to print directly onto fabric rolls.